We Don’t Need No Stinkin’ BA
Jul22012
You know, usually it takes eons for a college to make a change, but McDaniel is speedy. When Pam went back and said, “The BA is making things harder for people,” they asked me if I thought a bachelor’s degree was necessary, and I said, “Nora doesn’t have one,” so they decided to get rid of that requirement. One catch: you can’t get credit hours if you don’t have the bachelor’s, it’s more along the lines of an audit, but you’d get the same class everybody else gets. The big benefit is to the international students, I think, but I’m hazy on all of this because it’s administrative and I do not administrate. Pam knows all, however, so ask whatever questions you have in the comments and I’m sure she’ll swing by to answer them.
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28 Comments to 'We Don’t Need No Stinkin’ BA'
On July 2, 2012 at 4:54 pm JulieB said...
Thumbs up.
On July 2, 2012 at 7:00 pm Mary Stella said...
I faxed my transcript request to my alma mater this morning. I’m probably worrying needlessly that my less-than honors GPA would cause McDaniel to turn me away. However, seeing this makes me worry less. I have a degree but like knowing the requirement isn’t necessary. Thanks for that!
Do we need to read the books in a particular order? I have most of them and can start re-reading at any time. Such torture. Read Heaven Texas for the umpteenth time? Dogs and Goddesses again? Crack open the hardcover of Saving Graces one more time?
Such taskmasters, I tell you!
On July 2, 2012 at 8:39 pm Jenny said...
We’ll be reading them in a particular order, but you don’t have to.
On July 2, 2012 at 8:47 pm robena grant said...
Now you’re just screwing with my head. I am so tempted. Ha ha.
I have a Nursing Degree and a Post Grad Nursing Degree and both are from Australia. Every time I’ve taken an American Uni course it has been for audit only, or a certificate course through their extension program. I love the required reading list, and if I remember correctly, I’ve read them all. But to dissect them all…now that would be awesome.
On July 2, 2012 at 10:50 pm oneoftheotherjennifers said...
I was out of town when you first posted about this. When I finally saw it, I thought sadly of all the reasons I shouldn’t take the course, and moved on to the next post.
Today I sat down to make out my to-do list, and came to “follow my dreams.” I went back to the original post this evening, and was idly reading details of the course out loud to my husband while he worked on his laptop. After about ten minutes, he turned around, gave me his sweetest smile, and said, “You need to do this.”
I’m applying tomorrow.
On July 11, 2012 at 12:06 am Sheri (aka Rescue Cherry) said...
Your husband–he’s awesome!!
On July 3, 2012 at 12:51 am Kate George said...
I’m considering auditing, not because I don’t have a BA – I do. It’s just financial really, do I really need a MA? Probably not. Although it does seem like a pity to do the work and not get the degree. It costs less to audit and I’m not getting a lot of support around here. I’m afraid they still see me as the chief cook and bottle washer.
On July 3, 2012 at 12:37 pm Pam Regis said...
It’s not an audit. It’s a different path to registration that acknowledges the fact that having a BA is not a requirement for being a romance writer. The BA (or the B-something) is a requirement for taking grad courses for credit at McDaniel, but if you don’t care about the credits, we don’t care about the bachelor’s. It’s also not cheaper. There’s no price break because we’ll expect the same level of engagement from everyone, and deliver the same feedback to everyone.
On July 3, 2012 at 1:53 am Clever Cherry said...
I hope you’re doing it more than just one year cause I want to do it eventually since it doesn’t require a BA.
On July 3, 2012 at 12:39 pm Pam Regis said...
Yep, the plan is to put in place a program that will be permanent.
On July 5, 2012 at 1:36 pm inkgrrl said...
Le sigh. If only I had the moolah right now… very glad it’ll be a permanent program.
On July 3, 2012 at 3:55 am JLondon said...
This is a huge benefit for international students. There are formalities to be satisfied in order to admit us to a credit-bearing program, and it would have been almost impossible to meet them in time. I’m surprised and impressed by how quickly McDaniel has been able to solve the problem. It’s very much appreciated.
On July 3, 2012 at 11:13 am nightsmusic said...
I’d moved on from the original post as well since I never finished my bachelor’s. I’m still sad that I can’t afford to audit, but I wanted to say how awesome you are for opening this to everyone.
On July 3, 2012 at 12:05 pm Robin S. said...
Off topic curiosity question. The word play on top I remember from a scene in “Gotcha”. Is it from that or did they steal it from somewhere else?
On July 4, 2012 at 2:10 pm Jenny said...
Originally it was from The Treasure of the Sierra Madre, and then everybody started using it. It’s a meme now.
See http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stinking_badges for some of the places it’s been since, but really, it’s all over the place.
On July 4, 2012 at 3:07 pm Robin S. said...
Thanks!
On July 4, 2012 at 4:03 pm Judy Hudson said...
I too wonder about international students. I have my BA from a Canadian university, and when you go the the registration site, then to the international student page, it says your credits have to be validated by an outside agency, and lists them, but I assume this will not be necessary? It also talks about a visa for international students. Also not necessary? Can we internationals just apply on the US student application and not mention our BA credits? Will people with credits move to the head of the line assuming there are too many applications? I have a signed and sealed transcript in my hot little hand…
Sorry for all the questions but the website does not deal with specifically with online internationals. Thanks for the time and trouble.
Judy Hudson
On July 4, 2012 at 6:35 pm Jenny said...
If you want the credits, you’re going to have to jump through the hoops. If you don’t care about the credits, then you’re free to just sign up. I think. PAM?
On July 5, 2012 at 7:48 am Pam Regis said...
Jenny is right. For credits–the hoops. (The whole process of certifying non-US degrees before admission to a grad program has to do with the rules and regulations that we follow as an accredited higher ed. institution. We think it’s cumbersome, too. To coin a phrase–Argh.)
BUT, BUT–Anyone–no matter where you live, no matter if you’ve got a bachelor’s or not–can simply sign up for the noncredit option, pay the money, and you’re in. Email me at pregis at mcdaniel dot edu if you need help. I’d send you to Jason, our admissions wizard who conjured the non-credit option in the space of one day (had to be magic), but he’s on the road.
On July 4, 2012 at 5:04 pm oneoftheotherjennifers said...
Raising hand politely…
I am wondering what you would recommend in terms of having writing prepared before class begins. I had originally assumed we would be starting from scratch, but your responses in the earlier thread have made me uncertain.
I have thirty or forty pages of detailed character backgrounds. I have a plot summary, but not a detailed outline. I have pieces of scenes, but no completed scenes. In short, I have been toying with this, since I was waiting to get serious until next year when a number of major time commitments will drop off. However, opportunity is knocking, and I’m opening the damn door. I’ve been shouting, “Coming!” for the last twenty years.
What would be the best preparation for class? Should I hammer out a detailed outline? Should I research scene structure and try to put some finished scenes together? Or would it be best just to leave everything as is so that I don’t make a mull of it? Or do I need to try to write a rough draft by the end of August? I would have to bail on a lot of commitments I’ve made in order to do that.
Any advice would be greatly appreciated.
On July 4, 2012 at 6:43 pm Jenny said...
The great thing about the way Pam organized this is that it starts with eight weeks of reading and talking about the romance story, so that gives you time to work on your book for the second the class.
The second class is about characterization and writing scenes. There are assignments every week having to do with your book, but most are exercises or specific pieces of your book (first meets, sex scene analysis, etc.) and critiques; the big one comes in the fourth week and that’s your complete opening scene. If you’re thinking, “Big deal, opening scene,” it’s the most important scene in your book, and it has to do a lot of things.
The third class is about structure, and you’re going to need to know your whole book. You won’t need to hand it in, but you’re going to be doing assignments on turning points and act content and how you’re handling things like story arc. The big assignment there will be your climax scene plus a full synopsis, but we’ll walk you through the steps to get there.
The fourth class is a workshop where you’ll put up big sections of your book for critique.
And the fifth class is about publishing and getting the manuscript ready to send off, but we’ll also be talking about the book as a whole.
Each class is eight weeks. I have no idea of the dates that McDaniel intends to schedule them, but they’ll be pretty close together. So figure forty weeks to get the book together, but you’re going to be working like crazy that whole time if you don’t have some of it done now.
So my advice is to get as much on the page as you can now. But that’s always my advice, no matter what we’re talking about.
On July 4, 2012 at 7:08 pm oneoftheotherjennifers said...
OK. I can do this. Thank you.
On July 5, 2012 at 8:03 am Pam Regis said...
The schedule for the first two courses:
Fall 2012
WRT 521 Reading the Romance, August 27-October 21, Instructors: Jennifer Crusie and Pamela Regis,
WRT 522 Writing the Romance I, October 22-December 16, Instructor: Jennifer Crusie
The schedule for the next two courses:
Spring 2013
WRT 523 Writing the Romance II, Late Jan-to Late March. Instructor: Jennifer Crusie
WRT 524 Romance Writing Workshop, Late March -Mid May Instructor: Jennifer Crusie
Summer 2013:
WRT 550 Publishing, Late May to Mid July, Instructor: Jennifer Crusie
Each is eight intensive weeks.
On July 5, 2012 at 9:55 am Jenny said...
So there’s a break between the second and third course to work on the ms., too.
On July 14, 2012 at 3:43 pm oneoftheotherjennifers said...
Yay!!! Got my McDaniel acceptance letter. Working, working, working on my rough draft. Given that everyone else who has commented that they’re taking the class seems to have real experience, I feel like I’m going to get an even more valuable opportunity. I’m lucky you are offering this class when I’m just beginning to think about a career for the next phase of my life.
On July 15, 2012 at 3:18 am Jenny said...
Oh, excellent. This is going to be so much fun. Well, fun for me.
On July 23, 2012 at 12:45 pm Julianna said...
I know McDaniel is planning on offering this next year, too. Jenny, are you planning on teaching it again, or will it be someone else? I mean, I know life happens and you could change your mind before next year — I’m just wondering if your current plan is to teach it again next year. I’m really having a hard time finding the money right now, but I really, really don’t want to miss this opportunity if this is the only time you plan on teaching it.
On July 23, 2012 at 12:58 pm Jenny said...
As far as I know, I’ll be teaching it again. We have no idea how this is going to go, so I can’t guarantee this won’t be the only one, but I can tell you that McDaniel is committed to it, and so are Pam and I. Given everything that’s hit me this year, I’m not giving anybody guarantees on anything.